So it has been more than two years..

Thanks for taking the time to reply. I totally identify with the not having motivation when you're not being graded for it, yea! I think that's what I've been lacking, motivation, because its been so long, I've felt I'm not capable of getting back and better to where I was.

When I stopped, I was at that point where I was getting to learning new vocab easily, but the hanzi was just a constant struggle. That's what really put me off..

I think the best motivation (personally grading isn't that motivating for me because you can get good grades but still not be that great, something I learnt when I did Spanish at high school) is having something to look forward to. Not everyone has the luxury of planning a trip to China, but that would be one of the best ones. That way you think that you need to get good before you go, you want to talk to cab drivers and order food on your own etc. If that's not an option, do the same where ever you live but at a local Chinese restaurant or something similar. We are quite lucky that there are so many Chinese people around the world, so there is always an opportunity to use it. Make that your goal and work towards it.

In terms of hanzi, what I did was I didn't start straight off with writing, I learnt to read first and got a feel for the characters. That made it so much easier for when I actually started to learn how to write. People will most likely disagree with this, but I don't find writing characters THAT important unless you feel like you are going to need it for a test or a job.

Hey, good for you! O(∩_∩)O~good luck(*^__^*) …

Yeah that's a good one, every time I'm in a tourist type place and they shout at me in English, I just say 我听不懂, which usually gets them cursing at me in Chinese.

Re: " i have a chinese girlfrined who annoyingly wants to speak english." hee hee, sounds like your girlfriend has an annoying boyfriend who only wants to speak Chinese. Well, I'm sure many poddies can attest that having a Mandarin speaking significant other is NOT the easy road to fluency.

But I was more interested in your story about the girl with the hanzi name tag who was "offended" when you asked her name. Often Chinese people to whom I speak (in Chinese) will ask "and can you also read Chinese?" So I think the person you met is an exception. I don't think my spoken Chinese is all that bad, but people assume (probably reasonably) that one can become quite proficient in spoken Mandarin and remain illiterate.

yep, my wife is Chinese and her English is so good that we almost always use that to communicate.. bit annoying really!!

Well, if you are as annoying as I am and persist with trying to speak to the wife in Mandarin you will probably get :

You: "how do I say this in Mandarin"

Her: " say it any way your want.:

or

You: "If I say "xxxx," is that the best way to express it?

Her: "Whatever"

Probably best to put the relationship first and pay a teacher to teach you Mandarin.

By the way, if we don't have it already we need a CPod lesson on how to ask about how to say things like "is this the best way to say it?" or "is this word colloquial or formal?" or "is this appropriate in this circumstance>" I often want to ask about subtle nuances in the language but don't know how to form the question. Any poddies seen such a lesson?

I haven't seen a lesson on that as such, but you quite often hear John ask in Upper-Intermediate lessons asking things like this. But yeah it would be a good lesson.

I can totally relate to this. I've finally resigned myself to the fact that in order to have a harmonious life my conversations with the wife will forever more be English:English or Chinese:English (with me speaking the Chinese). And not to expect any corrections of grammatical mistakes - as long as my meaning is understood. The unfortunate downside is that my spoken Chinese is now miles ahead of my listening ability, albeit probably littered with mistakes! I guess at the end of the day, the most important thing is that people can understand your meaning, even if you haven't expressed it in the best and/or grammatically perfect way. I must admit I do the same with her English - as long as I can understand, I don't bother correcting. As bad as each other really, no wonder we get on so well.

Yeah i totally identify. Also in the beginning i was so concerned with being able to speak that i was not aware of the listening aspect. Lately I'm spending more time listening. I remember John saying once don't worry guys this will begin to sound natural. I didn't think it would or it could for me but he is right. I have a long way to go but its starting to feel natural. I wonder how i ever survived here not being able to communicate.

I love also how sooooo many people just expect foreigners here to not be able to under stand. Like today i was out shopping with the girlfriend. There were two 服务员 standing there. One knew me and that i can understand some Chinese. The other one started talking about me and she tried to hush her because she knew i could understand and the lady just says very confidently like its not possible for me to understand 他听不懂。Not long later her jaw was on the floor.

Before i wanted everyone to know i could communicate in mandarin but these days it feels i have less to prove. But i still have to keep up the practice. Like any skill i feel i have to keep working it.

Also i think its important for the idea to be reinforced that mandarin will start to feel normal. Because i didn't believe it till it started happening.

I think its also easy to think that its all me and not chinese pod. But without cp it would take sooooooo much longer. Thanks guys.

i did find the condescending (unintentionally) attitude local chinese had toward foreigners speaking Chinese one of the more frustrating things while living in China. It's like every time you talk to someone you have to prove yourself that you are a competent speaker to them. It put more pressure on me at times as well to not make mistakes.

嗯嗯 :)

I agree. But I should say that I'm Australian. Australians attitude toward

Asians but lets say Chinese here, learning English is terrible at best.

I am treated much better in China than Chinese are in Australia.

A lot of Chinese people are happy if you can speak a little Chinese.

Where as Australians don't care what your English is like.

Not all of course but most people I've seen and met. This is their attitude.

Maybe because seriously learning a second language at school

is not compulsory therefore ignorance about how difficult learning another language is, is not understood by most Australians.

I'm an American and I think the typical American's view towards non-native English speakers is probably worse. There's is def little to no tolerance towards those with foreign accents and have difficulties with speaking English among a lot of Americans. I think it has to do with US' long history of racism and nativism towards immigrants. Asians in the US themselves are subject to ridicule because of their difficulties with English like their "l"s sounding like "r"s. The most obvious example of this is on the TV show South Park.

So yea, its def not that bad in China but it was def a frustrating experience at times nonetheless.

Yeah I hear ya man. I didn't want to make a typical Aussies sound bad

but they don't seem to be very welcoming.