Cultural translation

Maybe it's just me, but I feel that many Chinese think that foreigners are barbarians and incapable of speaking Chinese. They speak to us (initially) in English because they "know" we couldn't possibly speak Chinese. My career field has a high turnover rate in the local (Chinese) department, mainly cause it's just a transient career (get experience and then move on) for them. Because of this I'm always meeting new colleagues, and when I do I'm always (initially) spoken to as if I'm a 2-year-old child. It's only when I respond in fluent Chinese, with some addage, that they're eyes pop out of their skulls and they switch to only speaking Chinese with me. I have found, however, that in their eyes I'm different than the other foreigners we work with just because I can speak Chinese. I feel that I'm taken much more seriously. Depending on how comfortable you are with your oral Mandarin, you may or may not want to use it in the business place. I only speak to my colleagues in Chinese because otherwise things don't get done the way I want them to, so I guess it also depends on what you're trying to accomplish.

哦,写错了.谢谢. 大部分的时间我就会说"我还差的远呢". 原来我刚到中国的时候我总是答复"谢谢". 不过我才发现一些人感觉我太自信了,所以我开始入乡随俗了,也习惯他们的生活方式了. 不过我也烦"哪里哪里"的. 太丢人了. =)

Hmmm, in Beijing at least, nobody seemed particularly surprised or impressed by foreigners babbling a few words of Chinese. If anything, they were a bit impatient with any inability to understand what they were saying. Must be the Dashan effect, and all those foreigners on the variety shows on TV. Man2Toe, in all fairness, until very, very recently the only way for foreigners to learn Chinese was to either go live in China for a number of years or major in it in university. The resources we take for granted today simply didn't exist. For example: an endless supply of Chinese language text and audio on the Internet; conversation partners over Skype; teaching sites like ChinesePod (and CSLPod, iMandarinPod, ChineseLearnOnline, etc); forums for networking and sharing ideas with others who are also learning; stores like Amazon.com for searching and ordering highly specialized books; software for spaced-repetition flashcards and instant dictionary lookups; specialty Chinese-language channels on television or cable TV. Also, in all fairness, the reasons Asians got busy learning English was not so much love of Western culture, or care and respect for Western people. It was because English became the international language of business and technology, and learning it had practical economic benefits. America was and for the time being still is the world's number one economy, and people wanted a piece of that and what it represented. Of course, friendships and love of culture can develop out of that as well. The wheel of history keeps turning and today we all have our half-noble and half-mercenary reasons for learning Chinese...

aeflow has got a point. The response you get as a Chinese-speaking foreigner does very from place to place. In Harbin it's a absolutely unheard of (in many locals' eyes) to come across a Chinese-speaking foreigner in-person. Yet when I was in Beijing no one seemed to look twice. As far as the impatient response goes, however, I think it goes back to that "here's a silly barbarian trying to speak Chinese" attitude that many Chinese seem to have. Most Chinese, if given the option between trying to speak Chinese to a less-than fluent foreigner and their own broken English, will certainly privledge the latter. But, of course, I'm the same way with speaking Chinese over English.

Man2Toe, see article on the BBC website : Fears over Australia's language decline. 'Official figures show that only 13% of high-school students now graduate with a foreign language - compared with more than 40% in the 1960s.' http://news.bbc.co.uk/...

When I run into Chinese in the U.S. (mostly on campus), they are, or course, surprised to run into a (sort of) Mandarin speaker and seem quite happy to converse in Mandarin. In China, assuming English fluency, the opposite seems to be true. I wonder how much of it is just taking advantage of the opportunity to practice a foreign language.

Kyle, your post made me smile. In my experience most people are rather shocked that I, an western, am able to communicate using Mandarin. With this, like Kyle experience, the mood of the social interaction changes, it is clear a "connection" has been established. I am not sure exactly how to define this "connection" other than that I have shown a basic respect to this person. I have expressed that I have a respect for them and their culture-enough respect for them and their culture that I would spend thousands of hours learning how to talk with them. Sadly, this is all too rare in the east and west relationship. The relationship is out of balance. To guess at a number to illustrate how unbalanced it is; maybe 7000 Asian speak some English and/or European language to 1 westerner speaking and Asiatic language. This being the case, I would not be surprise to run into some Chinese people who don't believe a Western can learn Mandarin. Let us here at Cpod change that. Let us care enough for the Chinese people to respect them and their culture; learn Mandarin:)

tianfeng, what do you answer to those exaggerated compliments then?

那里那里,我还差的远呢. 你夸了. 我不敢当. 就是很一般吧.

tianfeng, I totally agree that living in China does not simply result in good language. I have lived here long enough to know. After many, many years in China I am really embarrassed about my language capacity. I need Chinese mostly for work. I am just so tired of talking like a barbarian when I know the language is so rich and Chinese delight in people being able to use sophisticated language. So I signed up to Cpod in an effort to get my level up one step ... To have a friend or two with whom all the socializing happens in Mandarin, that would be helpful. However, since my friends are mostly from a 少数民族 whose language I am also studying, I seem to improve much faster in that language. And another question: Do you ever find that you get impatient when you speak Chinese (good, understandable Chinese) to someone here in China and the person you talk to answers back in English? I often have to check my attitude when that happens. And it's not that I want to show off my Chinese or the other person their English. I can't quite put my finger on it. But it annoys me whenever it happens.

Kyle 谢谢，我也受不了那个‘哪里哪里’ （不是‘那里’），听起来’我不敢当‘最好。

I always just say ”谢谢， 但是我还写得很不好." I know 哪里哪里 is the proper answer or you can even say 过奖，过奖but for me I am still western and responding back to a complement by refusing it is considered rude. As far as getting frustrated at people speaking English to me I do. My first night in GuangZhou my brother took me too a bar called C-union and it was packed with foreigners. Some girl was giving em eyes so i went up and started talking to her. She spoke to me in English and I spoke back in Chinese. I flippantly said " 对不起，我听不懂英文. 请说中文." she responded back by saying well she dosen't speak Chinese. I stood there for a second and than walked away. I laughed, saying to myself " I didn't come halfway around the world to speak to Chinese people in English." That however is a rarity. I usually don't find people whose English is better orally than my Chinese. And I am very persistent, I will refuse to speak English back to them. I have gone on for 10 minutes of me speaking in Chinese and then responding in English. In the end I usually win out.

I realy enjoy talking with people who make no comment on my ability to speak Chinese. One of the best complements I have recived since I have been back was when I was on the train talking to several people in Chinese about the goals of university students in China and Canada and how they differ and one girl muttered to her friend. "他真得很聪明" I was happy to hear that because it meant they were no longer just listening to my Chinese, but actually listening to what I was saying. I always laugh when I get the standard "你中文说得很好啊" and I have only said something like "你好，这个多少钱。“ But more and more people are just talking to me rather than commenting on my Chinese. When I was in Beijing I was complemented several times but I did notice several other foreigners who spoke pretty well. Still though, I was out at dinner and there were probably 10 foreigners who had lived in China for several years and could not converse in Chinese fluently. Just living here isn't enough, although many in the west tend to think so. I, and I assume a lot of other people that live here have had to work hard to get where they are. Being in China is an advantage but it is not like you magically learn the language through osmosis with no effort. I actually speak less Chinese here than I did in Canada because I am without a group of people to converse with.