Dear laowai, don't mess with our Chinese-ness - China Daily Article
eupnea63355
January 14, 2010, 12:58 AM posted in General Discussionhttp://www.chinadaily.com.cn/opinion/2010-01/12/content_9303041.htm
I know we are so busy studying Chinese, but if anyone has a few minutes to read this opinion by Huang Hung on China Daily, I would be interested in your impressions, of people living outside of China and especially those inside. I've never read anything by her before and was surprised by the content.
changye
January 15, 2010, 09:27 AMIt takes a great deal of courage to eat raw oysters in China, from the standpoint of food sanitation.
andrew_c
January 14, 2010, 02:21 AMthat is a joke, right?
xiaophil
January 14, 2010, 03:02 AMMy problem is that I have to turn down chicken feet. Luckily, I'm a vegetarian.
Seriously, I think it is a practical joke. I don't know any native Chinese that could have written that without massive help. But I suppose she could have been helped. Well anyway, I still think it is a joke.
andrew_c
perhaps personally, but I've met multiple native Chinese people with English at native-level, including a flawless American accent. anyway, these people also happen to be too enlightened to have written such an article in earnest.
xiaophil
Yeah, I know they exist. I guess you are right. Still, I am skeptical for the same reason as what you wrote in your last sentence.
chanelle77
January 14, 2010, 03:07 AMI'm also a vegetarian, but *THEY* still try to trick me in to eating toad's eggs :-p.
andrew_c
January 14, 2010, 03:09 AMperhaps personally, but I've met multiple native Chinese people with English at native-level, including a flawless American accent. anyway, these people also happen to be too enlightened to have written such an article in earnest.
pretzellogic
January 14, 2010, 03:15 AMFunny article. And he's right about the fireworks, as least in the hands of 16 year old dudes. Somewhere on the internet, there are a few stories of 13-19 year old American dudes blowing up/off fingers, hands, heads with homemade fireworks (read explosives).
I thought it was ok to eat chicken feet anyway. Certainly no worse than the chicken head I had to eat once.
eupnea63355
January 14, 2010, 11:32 AMThanks for reading that. I was doubting my own reactions and was looking to compare mine with others. When I first read it, I thought it was almost laugh-out-loud funny. It read like a stand-up comedienne's routine, in my mind. The only thing I balked at was the reference to the mentally disturbed man who was executed in China. He was used as a mule by some drug dealing professionals, as the story goes, but I have not followed the story, to be truthful. I do believe that even the most crass humorist in the states would not touch on that one.
Then, I read some of the comments posted on the website. People saying "racist" and more. Where did I miss the point? So, then I gave the article to a professional human behaviorist to read. He took it completely seriously and talked of the hateful and pejorative attitude of the writer toward Americans (I reminded him of the Brit reference, to include westerners), her lack of understanding of American culture, and basically had nothing positive to say about the writer.
He did state that the context is important, and I really don't know what is the context of this article. Published by China Daily in the opinion section means what? It's not supposed to be funny, is it? Is this a reflection of how a segment of the Chinese population really feel about us? Is there an underlying attitude of disdain and superiority? ? I was wondering if you who live in China have picked up on this at all.
People who come to the US are welcomed and expected to become "Americans." People who go to China are always considered foreigners and are never truly welcome? Is this the case?
bababardwan
oh really? it may be serious? I was surprised when people were questioning whether it was a joke or not.It certainly struck me as something written with the intention of being funny and not serious at all.It sounded almost childish and playful the way some humour can be pitched.I didn't read the replies though of those who may have been more familiar with the context or the other reference.I guess I better take another look.
simonpettersson
I find it very hard to believe it would be serious. The comments are hardly a good indicator; after all, the people who don't realize it's a joke are the ones that are offended and are thus more likely to comment. Look at the YouTube comments on the videos from The Onion (if you're not in China, of course). They're full of people thinking it's for real.
pretzellogic
I thought it was funny from the first paragraph, but an indicator of the joke that the writer was making on her side was the indirect reference to the CCTV fire (here's the link:
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-02/11/content_7465570.htm
that happened about a year or two ago. This is the section:
we Chinese have great tolerance for fireworks; it's one night when you can do some damage and get away with it. For example, you can burn a building down, a brand new building, with stuff in it. How can you comprehend that level of generosity?
So I took it as firmly tongue in cheek, but i could be wrong.
andrew_c
On the other hand, the target audience of this paper, I was told consists mainly of high school and college students on the mainland, who would not understand this satire. In which case,it would be making fun of their audience. Is that possible? Maybe the alternative is more possible, which isn't far-fetched since even if the article is a little blatant and slightly exaggerated it is definitely reflective of very real, and common attitudes.
orangina
I think like most good satire, it touches upon truth. She was talking about how Chinese people tend to feel, but not condoning the attitude. And like most good satire, some people entirely miss the point. Had she seriously had a problem with westerners using fireworks she would (I hope) have focused on the fact that to westerners it is all fun and games, but to Chinese people there are serious religious and cultural implications. But instead she chose to state that Chinese people were more serious about their dangerous frivolity. In my opinion.
andrew_c
I hope, I'm truly thrilled if there is someone on the inside satirizing these xenophobic and racist attitudes. I wonder if they'll get it.
bababardwan
January 14, 2010, 11:38 AMoh really? it may be serious? I was surprised when people were questioning whether it was a joke or not.It certainly struck me as something written with the intention of being funny and not serious at all.It sounded almost childish and playful the way some humour can be pitched.I didn't read the replies though of those who may have been more familiar with the context or the other reference.I guess I better take another look.
matthiask
January 14, 2010, 02:20 AMpfew, if this is all the Chinese want, I can live with it. :)
pretzellogic
January 14, 2010, 01:41 PMI thought it was funny from the first paragraph, but an indicator of the joke that the writer was making on her side was the indirect reference to the CCTV fire (here's the link:
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2009-02/11/content_7465570.htm
that happened about a year or two ago. This is the section:
we Chinese have great tolerance for fireworks; it's one night when you can do some damage and get away with it. For example, you can burn a building down, a brand new building, with stuff in it. How can you comprehend that level of generosity?
So I took it as firmly tongue in cheek, but i could be wrong.
andrew_c
January 14, 2010, 01:47 PMOn the other hand, the target audience of this paper, I was told consists mainly of high school and college students on the mainland, who would not understand this satire. In which case,it would be making fun of their audience. Is that possible? Maybe the alternative is more possible, which isn't far-fetched since even if the article is a little blatant and slightly exaggerated it is definitely reflective of very real, and common attitudes.
orangina
January 14, 2010, 01:51 PMI think like most good satire, it touches upon truth. She was talking about how Chinese people tend to feel, but not condoning the attitude. And like most good satire, some people entirely miss the point. Had she seriously had a problem with westerners using fireworks she would (I hope) have focused on the fact that to westerners it is all fun and games, but to Chinese people there are serious religious and cultural implications. But instead she chose to state that Chinese people were more serious about their dangerous frivolity. In my opinion.
andrew_c
January 14, 2010, 02:01 PMI hope, I'm truly thrilled if there is someone on the inside satirizing these xenophobic and racist attitudes. I wonder if they'll get it.
kimiik
January 14, 2010, 06:07 PMI can't access Chinadaily's article because of a "504 - Gateway Timeout" but I used the cache of Google to get the text :
Dear laowai, don't mess with our Chinese-ness
By Huang Hung (China Daily)
Updated: 2010-01-12 07:02
Now, listen up, you foreigner boys and girls, Chinese New Year is around the corner and I want to talk to you seriously about fireworks.
I saw this picture in a newspaper, where a smiling, cordial Chinese girl (rather pretty as well) was explaining the tradition of lighting fireworks to a group of foreign guys. They all looked very happy.
I will let you know that is false information. Fireworks are no small matter, and no laughing matter either. So wipe that smirk off your face and listen up.
As a Chinese, I want to be honest with you. For the past 30 years, we have opened up to the West, and welcomed foreigners like yourselves to come here to do business, to make money, even gave you some easy credit to let you buy real estate, marry our women, whatever. But this does not make you Chinese. There are things we reserve for ourselves, and it really doesn't matter how long you have been here, just don't assume you can be one of us, and don't touch the following three things:
CHICKEN FEET,
SEA CUCUMBERS
AND FIRECRACKERS!
Most of you are well trained enough to withhold your chopsticks, whichever way you are holding them, and stay away from the chicken feet at Chinese dim sum restaurants. But some of you are show-offs. Most of the time, you are trying to prove to your Chinese girlfriend's parents that you are so Chinese. "Look, I am eating chicken feet. Mmm ... Good!"
Don't do that. We really get annoyed when foreigners try to chomp on chicken feet. Sometimes, you are so polite, you don't spit out the bones, you chew them and try to swallow them. That's totally unacceptable. Because, when you do that, most Chinese start getting anxious about you choking to death on the damn chicken bones. And it is very difficult to enjoy dim sum when you are anxious.
Sea cucumbers are not for you either. Most of you are rather intimidated by slimy sea things - jelly fish, sea cucumbers. But, there are those of you who are so brave that you insist on trying it, and pretend to enjoy it. Most of the time, you are a foreign businessman, you don't want to offend your Chinese host by not eating the most expensive dish ordered.
I've got some news for you. Guess what? He didn't order it for you! He ordered it for the Chinese at the table! Do you know how difficult it is to soak the sea cucumber so it acquires the right slimy texture? No one can master it in his own kitchen. Only the restaurants can. So stop trying to pick up the sea cucumber with your chopsticks, it will probably end up in your lap anyway. Just politely put the untouched dish back on the lazy susan. We are not impressed by sea cucumber chivalry.
Now fireworks. It is strictly, strictly for us Chinese. We really don't want you anywhere near fireworks. First of all, it is dangerous. You don't understand why 1.4 billion people have to turn into pyromaniacs for one night. It's totally beyond your comprehension. But we love it; we have been setting off these things since we were three and for 5,000 years. So let me just say that fireworks are not for barbarians like you. You don't get it. On the other hand, we Chinese have great tolerance for fireworks; it's one night when you can do some damage and get away with it. For example, you can burn a building down, a brand new building, with stuff in it. How can you comprehend that level of generosity?
And, don't you dare try to do the same, we simply have no tolerance for it. You try to burn a building down, we will kill you, because, you were probably high, and we really don't give a hoot whether you are mentally disturbed or whether your prime minister is going to make endless harassing phone calls.
So, you better be good, you better be nice, because firecrackers are coming to town!
(Huang Hung is an opinionator on arts, lifestyle and showbiz.)
BEBC
Yummy! Sea cucumbers sound just like Jellied Eels. You Chinese should try some Tripe before you think all westerners are squeamish about their diet. But I'm a bit miffed that we don't have the same tolerance for arson over here. Please don't kill those of us who are just trying to join in with the general merriment; we've sent out the gun-boats before, and we'll do it again.
I think you're just worried that the white man will come over there, steal your women, take your jobs and move in next door to you, forcing the price of your property down and making your life a misery with all the loud music and partying.
daniel70
Tripe is a popular Cantonese dim sum item.
BEBC
January 14, 2010, 08:16 PMYummy! Sea cucumbers sound just like Jellied Eels. You Chinese should try some Tripe before you think all westerners are squeamish about their diet. But I'm a bit miffed that we don't have the same tolerance for arson over here. Please don't kill those of us who are just trying to join in with the general merriment; we've sent out the gun-boats before, and we'll do it again.
I think you're just worried that the white man will come over there, steal your women, take your jobs and move in next door to you, forcing the price of your property down and making your life a misery with all the loud music and partying.
kimiik
January 15, 2010, 09:21 AMIn fact, sea cucumbers come mostly from south east Asia, are eaten "everywhere" in the world and used in french cuisine. Personally, I don't see the "chineseness" of the sea cucumber. ;o)
Speaking of slimy sea things, most of the chinese I know are rather intimidated by the raw oysters served in Europe. Even if it's used in cantonese cuisine, I guess there's a semantic problem with eating raw 蛎黄 (蛎肉 Oysters) as it won't be yellow if it's not cooked.
changye
It takes a great deal of courage to eat raw oysters in China, from the standpoint of food sanitation.
simonpettersson
January 14, 2010, 12:23 PMI find it very hard to believe it would be serious. The comments are hardly a good indicator; after all, the people who don't realize it's a joke are the ones that are offended and are thus more likely to comment. Look at the YouTube comments on the videos from The Onion (if you're not in China, of course). They're full of people thinking it's for real.
chanelle77
January 14, 2010, 01:51 AMThat is a funny / interesting article, thank you for sharing, loved the sarcasm :-)