Forgetting Chinese Characters

martijn819
August 27, 2010, 01:01 PM posted in General Discussion

As I struggle through my flashcards everday and commit them to long term memory its good to know that I am not the only one with hay for brains:

Wired Youths In China & Japan Forget Character Forms

 

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pretzellogic
August 27, 2010, 06:15 PM

I thought the last post in the link had an interesting comment regarding Chinese, and the consideration that writing is part of the culture.

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gaojian
August 27, 2010, 07:41 PM

iteresting comments about the length of time it takes to actually commit a character to memory as well. When I was studying Chinese full time I could do 80 new vocabulary words in a night and have them memorized for the 听写 the next day. However, if asked a week later to write some of the same characters I would forget how to write them altogether. I think even flashcards don't help much in the writing department, that is all muscle memory for me. To memorize a character I have to write it over and over again, day in and day out.

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mark
August 28, 2010, 02:07 AM

First, my ability to recognize characters is a lot better than my ability to write them. So, I have something in common with the 提笔忘字. However, I think it is very helpful to look for patterns in characters. For example, . is 行 with 圭 stuffed in the middle. 圭 is itself two 土 stacked together. For a longer sequence, you can start with 木, double it up to get 林, put a 广 on top to get 麻, then shove in a 石 to get . Or, the characters and are all not commonly used as stand-alone characters, but are all quite productive in regard to appearing within several commonly used characters.

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CáoKǎi
August 28, 2010, 03:10 PM

I realize that I could set off a controversy just by mentioning this (in)famous book, but I find Heisig and Richardson's "Remembering Simplified Hanzi" immensely helpful in systematizing character learning - taking advantage of the patterns Mark mentions - and thereby greatly improving my retention of them.

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ouyangjun116
August 29, 2010, 04:21 AM

CaoKai, I couldn't agree more with you.  I prefer the Matthew's book, "Learning Chinese Characters".  Exact same method as Heisig, but it includes more to the story to remember tones and pronunciation.  I use this method to learn all my characters.  After learning a Chinese character with this method I can retain it long term after only seeing it a few times.  That is both from a recognition and writing perspective.  I use this method along with Anki.  According to my Anki results, my retention of character production and recognition is 92% overall.  I'm currently up to 1,900 字 with a goal of 3,000 by the end of this year.  

 

 

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CáoKǎi

Yeah, I use the Heisig and Richardson book along with Skritter. I only quiz production, so my retention is 87%.

I decided to go with their book, because I preferred their stories more. I suppose it's just a matter of personal taste. I figured pronunciation is something I'd best learn by associating the characters with words I use in speaking over time. I figured if I really needed to read out loud, I'd have to do it quickly, in which case I wouldn't have time to remember the story for the pronunciation. So the pronunciations seemed like something I'd best just associate with the characters through use over time.

But to each his own. Glad your doing well with this sort of method. I think more people should use it. The quote from the Chinese teacher about how you can't systematize character learning and just have to do by rote memorization I find very wrong. I think many Chinese just believe that because that's been their only experience in their educational system, which sorely lacks a critical thinking element.

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hkboy

Hi CaoKai,

I've been using the Heisig book too. I actually looked at the Matthew's book but I think they only dealt with Simplified characters.

I love the book but you are right - people seem to love it or hate it. My friend was looking to get started learning characters and I suggested the Heisig book. He ordered it, used it, and said he did not like it at all.

Anyway, I'm up to around 400 characters. I started character study in Jan. and have been on and off with it.

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hkboy

Hi ouyangjun,

I think I remember you from our last discussion. Good to hear you are learning from this book. Like I said above, I think I looked at this book and it looked good but I think it only had simplified characters.

Good luck on your march to 3000!

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vivian1
August 30, 2010, 08:38 AM

I agree with mark~ It becomes much easier if you learn remembering them "component-by-component. Besides, lots of characters with the same component have similar pronunciations. Eg, 样、洋、痒、佯,these four have 羊 in them and similar pronunciations. By the way, you can choose HNHSoft Chinese Dictionary as I do, it has native pronunciation for every Chinese word.

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go_manly

This is a promo, right?

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vivian1

Hi, I was just suggesting because I really found it helpful and hope that it can help more people...

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trevorb
September 07, 2010, 08:29 PM

I too sympathise with this, I have a much greater recognition of character using pinyin IME on the computer than I have recollection of how to write the character unaided.

I have not found any of the learning characters books as a help, but I suspect this is because I don't work visually very well, my brain works using logic.  Unfortunately this doesn't work brilliantly for Chinese chars as although some have logic others seem to just come out of the blue!  I have to just bulk remember.

I think that availability of reading matter is key to holding the chars in your head and those exposed through living in china must remember more quickly.  I'm a 汉字 junkie reading chars where ever I find them, which is not many places, but I'd love to find a news site that uses hanzi but is aimed at communicating with young people and thus discernible by me!  Xinhua is too depressing with the number of chars I don't know.