第一回: Chunk 1

Collegue just pointed out that the chunk 真事隐 (the hidden truth) also sounds very similar to 甄士隐 - the guy we already know from the headline...

Cool stuff!

Hi xiuaoanolga

sounds good. Why not post it here - maybe in chunks?

The translations from French should be manageable somehow...

Hi changye,

it is!

加入我们吧!

Hi!

这个"也"就是一种所谓虚词: 在古代的时候中文什么标点都没有, 所以作者用"也", "耶", 等等表明句子的末尾。"也"含义也可以标志现代的"是" (动词)、"!"、"."等等。

Xiaoan

Henning

     Appreciate your great effort. I think we will learn a lot from this group. I read the story many times in English. It will be a great pleasure to read it in Chinese with your help. keep going, Jung from Atlanta

Hi henning,

I just respect you. This must be your ideal lifework!

xiaoyan,

thanks for the explanation!

user1283,

I consider this as a group learning effort with heavy emphasis of learning on the job which means making & correcting mistakes together... Please only take my "translations" as clumpsy (and most likely incorrect) attemps (although I do discuss them with native speaker). So you need more than a "grain" of salt to take them. I hope to get better, though, in the course of events.

liansuo,

thanks for your input - learned a lot! And please do not at all try to "hold back".

Just discussed this with another native speaker (my wife) and gained some further understanding.

Looking at liansuo's post I think the major difference / difficulty is the 而借"通灵" 之说.

First of all 之说 is "that theory" here (resp. lit. "of that theory") and the name of the theory is 通灵.

通灵 might be "language of non-human beings/entities" as liansuo pointed out above, but also the theory that a dream reflects real events. There is some ambiguity in here, but I more and more come to the conclusion that is what the fun in 红楼梦 is all about.

And we are still at the beginning of the first paragraph of the first chapter!

Henning,

也 is a copula in classical Chinese - the language gets a bit easier if you remember that there was no punctuation in the original. Many of the archaic characters are conjunctions which exist to signal the reader that the subject has changed (ie.故 = henceforth, then).

通灵 means "to gain consciousness/understanding" here.  It comes up again fairly soon in a context where it will make more sense.

Henning, if you wish, I had made a list of "xuci" I encountered in a year classical chinese. I can send it to you. However, the translation and axplanation (rudimentary) are in French...

Henning, thank you for providing this opportunity and investing so much effort.  I thought I could keep back -- but the chance of making terrible mistakes and learning "with red ears" is just too good to be passed by... :)  So here goes:

而借"通灵" 之说

Wenlin has the translation "possess supernatural powers" and "have human intelligence, said of animals,plants etc." for 通灵.  Since the author is talking about a rock in the title, the latter suggestion may apply in our case --

因曾because I once 历过 experienced 一番梦幻 a dream 之后 (I) afterwards 故 on purpose 将真事隐去 to disguise the real events, 而借"通灵" 之说 and, borrowing the "language of non-human beings/entities", 撰此<<石头记>>一书也 I wrote this "Story of the Stone" book.