Lets Play Translator
paulinurus
September 03, 2009, 10:30 AM posted in General DiscussionBelow are three chinese sentences found in Elementary or Intermediate lessons. I've picked them because they require a bit of EB thinking in order to figure out what they mean. See if you translate them. When translating, keep in mind that you want the communicative meaning (i.e. what is the sentence trying to communicate?) rather than the literal meaning. This is an experiment and we'll see what sorts of discussion (if any) could follow. Of course, Pete, our professional translator, would wait for others to play first before deciding whether to comment.
1. 我的房子不在这里附近的小区。
2. 想当年我独闯上海，什么苦没吃过。
3. 我为公司卖命二十年，他们说 炒就炒。
paulinurus
November 23, 2009, 03:15 AMHi Zhen and Orangina,
Seems to me the original translation would be OK if the 'back then' is placed at the end of the English sentence and a comma was used instead of the full stop.
想当年我独闯上海，什么苦没吃过。
Think of when I ran off alone to Shanghai, I had never suffered back then.
In other words, I suffered in Shanghai (but did not waiver since I had a strong belief in myself.)
I think we all got the gist of the story even though translating as one English sentence is a challenge....
He naively bolted from his home town because of love issues, he suffered in the new town, he persevered, he came through, he is now rich but still does not have his dream mate.
bodawei
September 03, 2009, 03:19 PM@calkins
I think you have #3 right. But I don't really understand #2 - is it rhetorical? As in 'when I think of those years alone in SH, what hardship'? Need help!?
helandou
September 03, 2009, 06:10 PMIt's a guess, but I think the second one means something like: "All I knew was Shanghai, so what did I know about hardship!"
chinkerfly
September 03, 2009, 06:22 PMHere are my attempts
1. My place is not in the nearby neighborhood.
2. Looking back on when I first set out for Shanghai, I had yet to experience suffering/hardship.
3. I sacrificed 20 years of my life to this company, but still they didn't think twice about firing me.
Maybe reading too much into that last one :)
helandou
September 03, 2009, 06:26 PMI think the first one means: "I don't live in the nearby 小区 ." Almost the same as bodawei's translation, except for that I don't think it's necessary that they are viewing the 小区. The questioner may have known that you live in a 小区 and also knows that there is a 小区 close to where the conversation takes place. Then you would say: "No, I don't live in the nearby 小区"....but in another one, further away.
zhenlijiang
September 03, 2009, 06:31 PMNo chinkerfly--I'd also do #3 similarly.
Also just a guess (but I do dimly recall this lesson dialogue actually),
on #2:
(Thinking back to) that year I was out there trying to make it on my own in Shanghai--name every kind of setback, I went through them all!
Or something along those lines, but rendered much more elegantly I'm sure, in the translation.
SPOILER (or not! haha) ALERT:
(This now successful person has run into an old friend/acquaintance, also successful, and they're trading news on each other's career and life--if I'm recalling correctly.)
zhenlijiang
September 03, 2009, 06:51 PM"炒就炒" I think is like
(I'm) fired and that's that (that's final)!
Fired means fired and that's all there is to that! Nothing to discuss!
They're firing me--doesn't matter that I gave them 20 years of my life!
有这样的语感，是不是？
bodawei
September 03, 2009, 02:54 PMI think the first one means 'my home is not in this nearby xiaoqu'. (I imagine the speaker and listener to be standing in view of a xiaoqu when this is said.)
paulinurus
September 05, 2009, 02:44 AMHey all, nice effort playing translator!
1. 我的房子不在这里附近的小区。
Cpod's translation: My apartment is not in a community near here.
This sentence was Cpod's example on how to use the word 附近 fu4jin4 meaning 'nearby'. From a WB perspective, this sentence seems a bit awkward since WB would usually just say "My apartment is not near here".
"My apartment is not near here" I wonder if this is how to say it in Chinese: 我的房子不在这里的附近.
2. 想当年我独闯上海，什么苦没吃过。
Cpod's translation: Think of when I ran off alone to Shanghai back then. I had never suffered.
This sentence is found in the UI lesson "Love Tangle Two". "想当年独闯广州，什么苦没吃过。但我心里一直有个坚定的信念......"
For me, the interesting word here is 闯 chuang3 (verb) - to dash off, to steel oneself to face the world, to venture out. 闯is a more dramatic and colourful verb than 去，My take of the sentence is "Thinking of those days when alone and naively I ventured to Shanghai."
Nciku has quite a few sentences using 闯 including this one: 年轻人应该到外面去闯世界。Niánqīngrén yīnggāi dào wàimiàn qù chuǎng shìjiè。Young people should go out and venture into the world.
3. 我为公司卖命二十年，他们说 炒就炒。
Cpod's translation: I busted my hump for that company for twenty years. And they fired me just like that!
To me, the important language structure to note here is
我 [为] [entity/somebody] [卖命] [length of time], [negative outcome]
I would think this structure can be leveraged to use in other statements such as:
我 [为] [友情] [卖命] [length of time], [你现在不理我] I put so much effort in our friendship and now you ignore me.
我 [为] [婚姻] [卖命] [length of time], [你要离婚我] I put so much effort in our marriage and you want to divorce me.
orangina
September 05, 2009, 03:01 AMAw, snap! for #2 I had "I miss those days alone in Shanghai, not suffer want." But doubted myself and changed it... I was closer the first time! I didn't know how to fit in 闯。。。
zhenlijiang
September 06, 2009, 10:17 PMhahaha, I was so way off I have to laugh at myself! And obviously I haven't studied the Love Tangle lesson yet.
zhenlijiang
November 15, 2009, 04:29 PMAh so I wasn't off in my reading of 什么苦没吃过 in #2 after all.
According to Changye.
That's good to know!
zhenlijiang
November 23, 2009, 12:51 AM2. 想当年我独闯上海，什么苦没吃过。
Cpod's translation: Think of when I ran off alone to Shanghai back then. I had never suffered.
This sentence is found in the UI lesson "Love Tangle Two".
"想当年独闯广州，什么苦没吃过。但我心里一直有个坚定的信念......"
....................................
Regarding the above, CPod's translation for this lesson dialogue has been changed. It now reads as follows:
Think of when I ran off alone to Guangzhou back then. What suffering didn't I go through? But, I always had a firm belief in my heart…
Upon making this change, Jason says:
I just asked Connie if you need to add question marks to rhetorical questions in Chinese and unlike English, you don't! How's that for tricky? 头疼！
orangina
November 23, 2009, 02:38 AMVery interesting, zhen... thanks for updating this. Sometimes I don't use question marks in rhetorical questions in English either... It may not be by the book, but sometimes the emtional impact requires an exclamation point or a period. But that would make things much trickier to translate!
Now what I can't understand is why 吃 also means suffer... especially in a culture that so loves it's food.
orangina
September 04, 2009, 02:23 AMHere is my effort:
1. My house is not in this neighborhood.
2. I think of those days alone in Shangai... what suffering! with nothing to eat.
3. I gave 20 years of my life to the company, and they fire me!
#2 was the hardest. I went to nciku and looked up words like 想 and 什么that I felt like I knew very well, but had a hard time with in this context. There is a feeling of nostalgia, but not missing. And of course I could be all wrong anyway!
calkins
September 03, 2009, 02:22 PMNice idea, this is fun. Here are my stabs:
1. 我的房子不在这里附近的小区。
"My home is not near this area."
Actually, this sentence confused me because I learned "...附近没有...", so I thought the sentence would be "我的房子附近沒有在这里的小区。" But I guess that would mean "This area is not near my home."
I think I just confused myself more. I'd definitely like more clarification on this one - it's an interesting construction.
2. 我跳过！
3. 我为公司卖命二十年，他们说 炒就炒。
I'm totally guessing at this one, but "I gave my heart and soul to this company for 20 years, and all they do is take advantage of me."
I'm dying to know what 炒就炒 means. "Fried me"...."screwed me"???? I'll wait to search these until there are more responses.