User Comments - changye
changye
Posted on: SBTG: Confucius
June 21, 2008 at 12:34 AMHi lee93,
That’s quite true. Besides grammar and vocabulary, it takes sufficient background knowledge, such as culture and history, to enjoy reading classical Chinese. Without them, it is often very difficult to properly understand, in particular, the meaning of a short verse or a sentence in classical literature. As for 焉, I actually tried to check all the usages of 焉 used in the Analects when I was writing my previous comment on 焉, but soon gave up the idea, which was completely beyond my competence, 小人焉能做到!
Posted on: 旧金山
June 20, 2008 at 9:51 AM汉语里的外国人名和地名基本上都是音译过来的，所以推测外文原名其实并不太难。但是，”旧金山”这种有故事性的地名很难猜出它是哪个城市。”费城”也是个很难猜中的外国地名。”费”是英语 phi 的音译，”城”是从 city 意译过来的汉字。费，城两个字合起来就成为 Philadelphia.
不过，用这种方法翻译的外国名字也有个好处，就是比较容易记住。比如说，Philadelphia 另有一个中文地名”费拉德尔菲亚”. 这么长的音译词，我怎么也记不住，还是费城好。供你参考，日文中也有个用汉字表示的 San Francisco, ”桑港”，就是 San(g)-port 的意思。你觉得怎么样？
那么，让我介绍另外一个令人伤脑筋的外国人名。”基督山伯爵”到底是谁？猜一猜吧！
Posted on: Regional Accents Part II
June 20, 2008 at 6:36 AMHi tvan,
This is a kind of “waving the white flag” posting. The explanation of “Mandarin” in one of online etymology dictionaries is as follows. Manchurian people entered into Beijing in 1644, therefore the word 满大人 could not exist before that, but the Portuguese word “mandarim” was already used in the 16th century. Wow, mandarin color also has something to do with “Mandarim.”
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"Chinese official," 1589, via Port. mandarim or Du. mandorijn from Malay mantri, from Hindi mantri "councilor, minister of state," from Skt. mantri, nom. of mantrin- "advisor," from mantra "counsel," from PIE base *men- "to think" (see mind). Form infl. in Port. by mandar "to command, order." Used generically for the several grades of Chinese officials; sense of "chief dialect of Chinese" (spoken by officials and educated people) is from 1604. The type of small, deep-colored orange so called from 1771, from resemblance of its color to that of robes worn by mandarins.
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http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=mandarin&searchmode=none
And however, interestingly and naturally, there seems to be a lot of Chinese people, even linguistic guys, who believe that Mandarin is the transliteration of 满大人. I’ll show you some related webpages.
http://njyw.njenet.net.cn/news/shownews.asp?newsid=211
“外国人称官话为mandarin,是从清代开始的,葡萄牙传教士称清朝官员为"满大人",于是连"满大人"说的官话也叫"满大人",mandarin就是这么来的。”
http://www.china-language.gov.cn/63/2008_3_10/1_63_3389_0_1205124588359.html
“官话”甚至都有了个mandarin的外国名字（据说因为满清官员都说官话，所以mandarin是“满大人”的音译）。外国人称官话为mandarin，葡萄牙传教士称满清官员为“满大人”，于是连“满大人”说的官话也叫“满大人”，mandarin就是这么来的。
Now, let me think this way. It is not that Mandarin was the transliteration of 满大人，but is that 满大人 (man3 da4 ren2) itself was the transliteration of mandarin, or mandarim. I don’t think that government officials in 清朝 willingly called themselves “满大人”. I suppose that the people who used, or invented, the word “满大人” was probably 汉族人, or 外国人 such as Portuguese missionaries.
If it was 汉族人, the similarity in the pronunciations was just a coincidence. But if 外国人, I think it is possible that Portuguese missionaries cleverly invented, or selected, 满大人 as a counterpart of “mandarim.” The exact pronunciation of 满大人 in Beijing around the 17th century was “muan3 da4 rien2”, and it sounds slightly more similar to “mandarim” to my ears than modern 满大人 (man3 da4 ren2) does.
Posted on: Missing Luggage
June 20, 2008 at 5:21 AMHi michele,
You are very right. Japanese saw is a pull-saw, not a push-saw. This is a well-know topic among Japanese people who learn English. I hear the reason is that a pull-saw doesn’t need a thick and rigid blade, and you can cut wood without pulling strongly, which means that a pull-saw is good for delicate woodworking. Furthermore, the woods used in Japan are relatively soft. For example, 桐 (kiri, paulownia) is one of the most prestigious wood materials in Japan, and it is very soft and easy to carve.
They say that Chinese people traditionally use a push-saw, just like Westerners, but a small saw that I bought here in northeast China is a pull-saw. Probably there are many types of saws in modern China. And I imagine that there are much more pull-saws in northeast China because of the Japanese rule in the first half of the 20th century. A Japanese saw is, of course, originated in China, but our ancestors modified it so that it is fit for use in Japan. Let me show you a typical Chinese saw.
This type of saw is commonly used by interior carpenters in China.
http://gz.fjedu.gov.cn/tyjs/ShowArticle.asp?ArticleID=3225
And, thank you for the name of the painter. To tell you the truth, I thought your avatar was a Rembrandt, one of the few painter names I know. Actually it was a female painter “Judith Leyster”, who I didn’t know at all until today. But at least she is a Netherlander, and lived in the same century as Rembrandt. My hunch was “partly” right…….hehe. By the way, I’m not a D.I.Y. guy, but my father is a genuine Sunday carpenter (and a craftsman). My dad even built a wooden garage from scratch by himself.
Posted on: Regional Accents Part II
June 20, 2008 at 3:24 AMHi auntie68,
The article was written in 2006, therefore it cannot be the latter which was announced by 陈水扁 in 2007. As you said, the character “去” is a little tricky. It has several important meanings, such as “go”, “leave”, and “remove”.
In Japanese, 去 only has the meaning “leave”, which may be the oldest usage of the character. You can hear the sound of 去 many times when you watch Chinese TV commercials. 去斑 (qu4 ban1) (or 祛斑 qu1 ban1, remove spots) is a key word in cosmetic commercials.
Posted on: Regional Accents Part II
June 20, 2008 at 2:59 AMHi tvan,
As for 沐猴而冠, on the second thought, I guess that “a false regime” or “fake regime” might be better in this case. Manchurian (满洲语, 满族语，满语，满文) is a de facto extinct language in China, and therefore almost most 满族 people can’t speak their “mother tongue”.
For 汉族人, the Manchurian rule of China (清朝) is a kind of “national” humiliation, and I hear that is one of reasons why modern China still has no official historiography of the Qing dynasty (清史), much less “中华民国史”！
Dramas and movies featuring 清朝时代 became popular (or allowed to produce?) in China only recently, probably in the 80s or 90s. I guarantee that a drama such as my beloved “还珠格格” was completely impossible to make in the era of the Cultural Revolution.
Posted on: Regional Accents Part II
June 20, 2008 at 1:56 AMHi tvan,
Let me show you translation of the following Chinese sentences first. As for 满大人, I’m going to post another comment later. Let me tell you my conclusion about “Mandarin” first, “you are right !”
台湾沐猴而冠，
Taiwan, a puppet regime,
弄出了一个要『去中国化』的总统
produced a president who wants to “Sinicizi”
和一些狗官们。
and some treacherous officials,
哎！ 阿扁，说声『喳』让老子听听。
Hey, you (陈水扁, Taiwan ex-president),
let me hear you say “Yes, sir!” (to the Emperor)
A supplementary explanation. In this case, “Sinicizi” does not mean “中国化”, but means “满洲化” (Manchurianize), which is the author’s better sarcasm. And you can often hear government officials say “渣” (zha1, Yes, sir!) in front of the Emperor in Chinese historical dramas featuring the Qing dynasty (清朝).
Posted on: Missing Luggage
June 19, 2008 at 8:48 AMHi Michele,
Japanese people really love wood. Japanese houses were made of wood in the past, and most of houses in modern Japan still have wooden frameworks, even though they are easy to catch fire. You can see a great number of wooden temples, shrines and craftworks in Japan, where people traditionally put great importance on craftsmanship. I love violin music very much and of course have read several books on traditional violin craftsmanship, it’s a typical wood art, in Italy. By the way, would you please tell me the name of the painter of your avatar? I think I saw it somewhere before.
Posted on: Regional Accents Part II
June 19, 2008 at 5:03 AMHi tvan,
I heard somewhere that Mandarin is the transliteration of the Chinese word 满大人 (man3 da4 ren2) , which meant high government officials in Qing dynasty. In other words, foreign people in those days thought that the language spoken by 满大人 was Mandarin. Anyway, here comes another intriguing problem!
Posted on: Regional Accents Part II
June 21, 2008 at 1:04 AMHi tvan,
I really enjoyed both reading and posting comments in this thread. It seems that a topic such as “Regional Accents” can attract many interesting questions and opinions. As for 满大人, we’d better not jump to conclusions.
What I wrote in my previous posting is just a layman’s idea. And more importantly, you can enjoy discussion forever, unless you draw a conclusion! I hope that someone would give the true etymology of 满大人 with firm evidence.